Five for Five with Jamie Hale – Part One

A few weeks ago I had the pleasure to sit down with Jamie Hale of Max Condition. He blogs regularly at knowledgesummit.net. One of the finest minds in the industry, Jamie has been at the fitness game nearly as long as I’ve been alive.  Jamie isn’t just brilliant, he’s jacked too, but don’t take my word for it. So with gratuitous ab shots out of the way, here’s the first installment of Five for Five, where I pose five hard to answer questions to vetted fitness industry experts.

RZ: First off, thanks for taking the time to sit down and chat today Jamie.  I appreciate it.  I’m curious, what does your intellectual background look like with regard to training?  As they say, stand on the shoulders of giants.  I come from an academic background myself, and in research, you look for the antecedents of today’s great ideas.  Who did you learn from, who do you still learn from, and who played the greatest influence in your present understanding of training protocols and methodologies?

JH: I have acquired my knowledge from a wide array of sources.  I have extensively studied the work of Siff, Zatsiorsky, Tipton, Rennie, Freedman, Owen, Dreschler, Verkhoshansky, Moore, Crewther and so on.   A great deal of my knowledge comes from sharing and discussing data with a group of people I have made connections with from around the world. We discuss Primary Research studies, Reviews, Seminar Key Notes, Books, Lectures, and so on.

The group consists of individuals who share a common interest in the science and practical aspects of exercise and nutrition (and to a lesser degree logic, and general science).  I have also worked with some great coaches over the years including Olympic Weightlifting Coach (member of Olympic Weightlifting Hall of Fame) David Pursley, boxing coach Emmit Igo (coach of numerous pros and amateur champs), Strength and Conditioning Coach John Davies, Brian Jones (MMA athlete, author of Sandbag Training Manual and The Conditioning Handbook published by Ironmind), Mike O’Donnell (owner of 4 seasons Mixed Martial Arts, BJJ Coach, BJJ black belt), Stonnie Dennis (Pro MMA fighter and Hook N’ Shoot Veteran) Darrin Van Horn (boxing coach and 2x IBF World Champ) etc.  Really, there are too many to name, but the ones I have just mentioned are some of my biggest influences.

Much of my knowledge has also been acquired through personal experience.  I have tried a multitude of different training and nutrition regimens.  I have participated in many different physical activities and I have conducted too many quasi-experiments to keep track of of. Currently most of the information I promote is derived from scientific journals and in the trenches knowledge.  I have a few coaches I stay in contact with such as David Pursley and Stonnie Dennis.  Alan Aragon (nutritionist and author) and I also discuss things on a regular basis.   I learn new things everyday and spend 6-8 hrs per day conducting research on all things science, fitness, nutrition, and logic.

I am also very active in the Kentucky Association of Science Educators and Skeptics.  This group has furthered my education and strengthened my critical thinking skills (skeptical thinking process), which is very important.  In fact, I recently gave a presentation at the JP Fitness Summit that addressed critical thinking and the fitness industry.   Education is a life long process.  It is important to look at all the data available on a particular subject if you really want to understand the subject.  Don’t cherry pick.  Oh yeah, if you are going to refer to scientific studies you need to learn how the read them first.  Understanding basic research methodology is a must.

RZ: How do you design a diet for long-term maintenance without being tied to Fit Day?  In this industry, so many people focus on the margins, the extremes, and forget the middle ground.  Few guys are going to be aggressively cutting or bulking lest they compete.  For lack of a better example, I’ll appeal to the present cultural Zeitgeist – presuming a guy has sub-par genetics (and he probably does if he’s spending hours on fitness sites and forums) how does a guy maintain Abercrombie levels of leanness and equivalent or greater musculature?   I’m not so interested in numbers but rather behaviors, general diet recommendations, and training philosophy.

JH: It is important for trainees to realize they have genetic limitations.  It is also important to realize reaching goals take time.  That does not mean they should use genetics as an excuse for sub-par performance or development, but it does mean realistic goals are necessary.  In my many years of working in the industry (18 yrs) I have seen many athletes and general fitness enthusiasts discontinue their programs because they were not reaching their goals fast enough or they simply felt like they would never reach their goals.  Most people want things right now and they feel like they can’t wait.  I am sorry that is not how it works in the fitness industry (or most other fields for that matter).

So, we have established that it is important to set-up realistic goals and it is important to give yourself a realistic time frame to reach these goals.  What is realistic?  It depends.   But in general I will have a client (such as the one you mention with sub-par genetics) set up monthly goals.  I prefer that goals be a little on the conservative side.  If the trainee surpasses their target weight, body fat comp, or whatever they are very pleased.  On the other end if expectations are too high and the goal is not reached then some mental anguish may occur which can have negative effects on further progression.  This is a delicate matter and it needs to be played be ear.  It is important that the trainee enjoys at least some aspect of their program and eating plan.  Of course, they probably won’t enjoy the entire protocol but it is important from an adherence point to ensure that they don’t despise every aspect of the program.

With some trainees this is a no win situation because they hate all physical activity.  Although most people can probably find something physical they enjoy or at least do not hate.  The same goes for food ask them about their likes and dislikes.  If you suggest they eat only bland foods and tell them food is not suppose to taste good it is unlikely that they will stick to the plan (at least the average trainee).  Try to make the workouts at least partially enjoyable and the same goes with eating plan.  Also remember you don’t have to be stuck inside of a gym to exercise.  Go outside and enjoy nature.  Modify the plan if needed.  No program is written in stone.

Again, a big thanks to Jamie for taking the time out of his busy schedule to participate in the column. Part Two will be posted shortly, so check back soon!

Tagged as: hypertrophy, muscle gain, power, strength, training